Call-In Classic Christianity Radio – Bob George P647 (07-01-21)
Synopsis
There are all kinds of people in this world, who go throw painful circumstances in life, sometimes they caused it themselves, as they were formerly lost and got trapped in sinful or even perverse behavior. But other times, you are the recipient of someone else’s sinful behavior such as a adultery, and so you have the right to file a divorce in such circumstances. Some women caught up in a situation like that incorrectly think they have to wait on the husband to file the divorce. That is simply not true. Listen as Bob George counsels this woman, who is notably upset, crying, and he asks her the probing questions to help her in making practical and wise decisions.
You will also run into people, who are blind and lost to spiritual things, and so they will throw out smokescreens, asking if you can prove to me where Cain’s wife came from or if Jonah was really in a whale? Such questions are irrelevant. A good question to ask such a person is this. You do not even know where my wife came from? Does that mean I am not married? Those are smokescreens. I find that effective, “If I can prove to you beyond a shadow of a doubt where this wife came from would you now get on your knees and accept Christ as Lord and Savior?” I never had a person say yes.
Now, as far as the state of the church, it is really in a sad state. Most churches today have become entertainment centers, seeker-sensitive churches. I personally think that it is by design by wolves who have infiltrated churches and seminaries, most notably is Rick Warren. First and foremost church should be for believers to grow, to know truth. As Jesus said, the truth will set you free and my people will worship in Spirit and in truth. Truth seems to be thrown to the wayside.
Music should be an expression of your heart, and if you do not know the Lord, there is not a whole lot you can express, maybe carnal emotions. But what about gratitude from the heart of what God accomplished by His death, burial and resurrection for you? That they do not know. It seems we have had many movements that have all led to a further crippling of spiritual growth in those in the church who are born again. We have had Promise Keepers, flawed from the get-go, spiritual formation that is taught as an advanced course in seminaries, Prayer of Jabez, as well as the seeker-friendly movement.
I find that the many churches I have been to there are book studies, and not bible studies. More emphasis is on a book by some author than actually bringing the bible and discussing it. Some books are useful if they are pointing people to truth from the scripture, but I find that few and far between. It is not someone’s opinion or some denominational interpretation of it. I have been to a church where the church gave out a free book to the entire church, by Richard Morris, but nobody stood up to test what he wrote, if it was true or not. No one properly explained the context of Malachi to correct that error.
I have heard someone say, “If you do not believe in Beth Moore, you do not belong to this church.” and will accuse you of being divisive if you test what a person says with the word of God. If you are born again, you have the Holy Spirit there to guide you into all truth. You are a member of the body of Christ, not a denomination or a building you go to. When you are born again, you are a member of Christ’s church, of whom He is the head. Recall that even the apostle Paul had to rebuke those who were teaching error in Galatia. Today’s climate is not conducive to accepting strong rebuke. Recall that Paul did not identify himself as any big deal, even though he was appointed an apostle by God. The one who waters and the one who sows are nothing. They are merely servants assigned to their task by God. But God causes the growth.
Transcript
Liz from Gallup, NM
Liz: I have been saved for about eight years, and love the Lord with all my heart. I have been married for nine years. (Crying on air). We got married in church, but he backed away. We are no longer together. I asked him to move because of the decisions. He wrote a written note to let the wife go.
Matthew 19:7-9
7 “Why then,” they asked, “did Moses command that a man give his wife a certificate of divorce and send her away?”8 Jesus replied, “Moses permitted you to divorce your wives because your hearts were hard. But it was not this way from the beginning. 9 I tell you that anyone who divorces his wife, except for sexual immorality, and marries another woman commits adultery.”
Bob: It does not say to write a note to let his wife go, Liz. You are reading something in there that is not there. It does not make any difference. That is not the issue. Here is the issue. Why are you so upset in your marriage?
Liz: He does not believe in the bible. He believes in tradition.
Bob: Like what, Liz?
Liz: He is gay.
Bob: He is gay?
Liz: Yes. He prefers a man.
Bob: Is he practicing homosexuality?
Liz: People have seen him and told me. I feel like going into a divorce.
Bob: Hold on Liz. Let me ask you the questions. I think I can help you more that way.
Bob: Have you confronted him with his homosexuality? Has he admitted that he has?
Liz: Yes.
Bob: Has he admitted that he has sexual relations with another man?
Liz: Yes.
Bob: Has he admitted all that to you?
Liz: Yes.
Liz: He was with his mother with that guy at his mom’s place. I think the reason why is because I am just not valuable.
Bob: No, the reason why. I do not know what all this disabling occurred afterwards, after you are married, but the issue is you take your wife for better and for worse, in sickness and in health. That is not an excuse.
Bob: Liz, if he is practicing homosexuality and you are married, he is comitting sin against you, and it is a sin that God says is therrfore that you have a certain right to divorce him. If he is going to continue in that lifestyle and mistreat you as a person that is disabled, do not ask him to write a writ of divorcement. You go ahead and do it.
Liz: Oh, okay.
Bob: Do not wait on him. From God’s standpoint, he does not want all this to happen, but a person that is practicing perversion, and homosexuality, is a little different than a sin. It is a perversion. When you are into that lifestyle, unless a person comes to the Lord, and literally recants the things that he has been doing, and recognizes them for what they are, sin. It is not an alternative lifestyle. You are not born that way. It is perversion. If a person is not willing to do that then you are in a perfect position to say it is over.
Liz: Okay.
Bob: You have taken vows before God and man, and you violated those vows and because of that, we are going to end the marriage. If that is your desire to do so, do not wait on him to do it. “I am going to let the husband do it because I do not want to file for divorce.” Nonsense. If a man has gone out and committed adultery and he has no desire at all for repentance, changing his mind, then you cannot live with that. That is why you are crying and upset. A wife cannot live with that.
Liz: I know. I know the Lord hates divorces too.
Bob: Well, He hates all sin, but that is why …
Liz: For many years …
Bob: Liz, again, you have to get off what God hates. He hates all sin. He hates worry. He hates anxiety. All of those things are sin. Anything not of faith is sin. You have to get off this thing that God hates, this and that. He hates sin. But when sin entered the world, all of us were indwelt with sin. That is why He had to go to the cross. He did not die because He loved sin. He died because He hated sin and what it did to His creation. He had to take away the sins of the world from the eyes of God, which He did, forever, in order to give you and me life in Christ Jesus.
Bob: The issue is that if you have a man, and he is deciding to go into another relationship and he has broken his marriage vows. If he has mistreated you and it appears he has, and all this stuff rubbed in your face, and you are disabled and that is your desire, then you go initiate that divorce and get on with your life.
Liz: Wow. Oh, okay. That sounds great. I looked at death do us part.
Bob: Well, that is true but he has not decided to wait until death do us part. He parted when he decided to have intercourse with some other person.
Liz: Thank you very much. God bless.
Bob: Okay, Liz. God bless you too. You keep us posted.
Dave from Utica, NY
Dave: I have been trying to get in touch with you. I have a question about spiritual maturity. In letters Paul writes to the churches, about giving milk and not solid foods, what is your opinion and understanding on that? Basically, the scripture is one steady scripture. Does scripture evolve into maturity also with that person?
Bob: Again, it does not say he feeds him milk. He says that is what you are feeding on. You should be eating strong food by now but you need milk because you are still carnal. He is not encouraging them to remain on milk.
1 Corinthians 3:1-9
1 Brothers and sisters, I could not address you as people who live by the Spirit but as people who are still worldly – mere infants in Christ. 2 I gave you milk, not solid food, for you were not yet ready for it. Indeed, you are still not ready. 3 You are still worldly. For since there is jealousy and quarreling among you, are you not worldly? Are you not acting like mere humans? 4 For when one says, “I follow Paul,” and another, “I follow Apollos,” are you not mere human beings?5 What, after all, is Apollos? And what is Paul? Only servants, through whom you came to believe – as the Lord has assigned to each his task. 6 I planted the seed, Apollos watered it, but God has been making it grow. 7 So neither the one who plants nor the one who waters is anything, but only God, who makes things grow. 8 The one who plants and the one who waters have one purpose, and they will each be rewarded according to their own labor. 9 For we are co-workers in God’s service; you are God’s field, God’s building.
Bob: If Paul was identifying himself as a person that plants or waters is nothing, but only God who makes things grow. Neither he who plants nor he who waters is anything. We are no big deals. He is talking about Paul. If Paul is not a big deal, I do not know why we should have a chest all puffed out. The one who plants and the one who waters have one purpose, to plant and to water, and they will each be rewarded according to their own labor. For we are co-workers in God’s service; you are God’s field, God’s building.
Bob: So he is saying, you ought to be teaching by this time. Hebrews says that. But you are still babes, sucking down milk, talking about milk when you were saved thirty years ago instead of growing in grace.
Dave: My question also has to do with the law. I know Christ came to die for our sins. Does the law still stand?
Bob: Not to the saved it doesn’t.
Dave: Is not Christ an embodiment of the law?
Bob: Not at all. We are dead to the law. If that is the case, to die to the law would be to die to Jesus.
Dave: Right.
Bob: If you do not die to the law, there is no way you can grow in grace. It tells us that.
Romans 8:14
14 For those who are led by the Spirit of God are the children of God.
Galatians 5:18
18 But if you are led by the Spirit, you are not under the law
Bob: If you are under the law you cannot be led by the Spirit, and if you are not led by the Spirit, you are not a son of God. So a person who wants to continually stay under the law, according to those passages, I would take a closer look at myself and ask myself if I am saved or not. These passages put together would tell you are not saved.
Dave: Other passages say the law is not a burden. You uphold the law.
Bob: No, it does not, Dave. It says you are to die to the law.
Dave: The law is death.
Bob: Dave, hold on. You are not understanding or you would not be saying what you are saying. The only thing the law can do is kill you.
Dave: I agree.
Bob: Okay. It cannot make you righteous. It cannot justify you. It cannot give you life.
Dave: I agree.
Bob: That is why it is no longer in effect. If you came to Christ, you are no longer under the supervision of the law.
Dave: Okay. I agree with you, Bob.
Bob: The power of sin is in the law. You have to die to that. You have to die to the law because if you are alive to it, it is like marrying Jesus and dragging your old ex-wife around.
Dave: Alright. I agree with you on that a hundred percent. My other question is this. Do you see this kind of legalism and corruption in spiritual life on earth today, that Christ was against?
Bob: Absolutely. When you see the heads of many denominations, and what is taught from the top down, and again, I am saying that because there are people who can be totally born again, but they have never grown. They are just babes in Christ, as you talked about earlier. You are babes in Christ, still on milk.
Bob: I cannot tell you how this happens. You take a person and he comes to Christ, and if he has any testimony, you will go on the circuit talking about the day you got saved, and never grow in grace. You can be as innocent as can be as to what is at the top. What is taught at the top is total legalism.
Dave: Thank you, Bob. I appreciate that.
Milt from British Columbia
Milt: I have a friend whose wife is a Buddhist and he is kind of a Buddhist. I am trying to get them won over. I wish I had your expertise, but I do not. He asked me a question that I could not understand. I responded, “If God said it is true, then just accept it.” He said “No, I need an answer.” He said, “When Cain went to another land and got a wife, where did she come from?” I replied, “If God said it is true, then it is true. It doesn’t matter where she comes from.” He said, “No, I need an answer.” So I said I would phone Bob George and get an answer. I do not know if you have the same answer or not.
Bob: Here is a guy throwing out smokescreens, saying “If I could prove to you a thousand percent where his wife came from.” Maybe it was his sister. We do not know. In the early days, in order to populate the world, there had to be inter-marriage between brothers and sisters. Quite frankly, it is none of his business where she came from. The bible says if she had a wife that ought to be good enough for anybody. George Bush had a wife and I do not know where she came from. I do not care. The fact of the matter he has a wife and I do not care.
Milt: That is what I told him.
Bob: The issue is those are smokescreens. You can say to a person, if I can prove to you beyond a shadow of a doubt where this wife came from, would you now get on your knees and accept Christ as Lord and Savior. And the answer back will be no. So then I will answer back that neither will I tell you where she came from.
Milt: Okay.
Bob: What good would it be for me to explain to you where she came from and you still remain dead, and dead in your sins and in the uncircumcision of your sinful nature. What good would it do? You are lost.
Milt: That is what I told him. “Just accept it. God does not lie.”
Bob: You do not even know where my wife came from? Does that mean I am not married? Those are smokescreens, Milt. I find that effective, “If I can prove to you beyond a shadow of a doubt where this wife came from would you now get on your knees and accept Christ as Lord and Savior?” I never had a person say yes.
Bob: They do the same thing with Jonah and the whale and Noah and the ark. “I can prove to you beyond a shadow of a doubt, would you now get on your knees and accept Christ as Lord and Savior?” Then I am not going to prove it to you. So your problem is not whether Jonah was in a whale or ate a whale. The problem is are you in Christ Jesus?
Milt: Just accept it by faith. God says that is how it is. It is true.
Bob: But it is not based on fairy tales. It is based on the fact that a man walked on this earth that we could have seen and talked to and walked with and claimed himself to be God. I do not think the fat Buddha claimed himself to be God. It is not this faith in faith. Faith has an object. The object is the person of Christ Jesus hung on a tree, taking away the sins of the world and was raised from the dead. Those are facts. His faith has to be placed in fact not fiction.
Milt: Okay. Thank you very much.
Bob: Thank you for your call.
Michael from Albany, NY
Michael: I was saved maybe four years ago, and I was going to a church. I recently left that church and began going to another church that is more conservative, and King James only, because my roommate decided to go that way. So I decided to try that out and I liked it. But I am wondering if there is a difference between. I hear terms like seeker-sensitive movement and people bringing the world into the church. I am torn on two sides. Should the church be open for everybody who wants to go or should it be just believers?
Bob: Michael, let me just say a couple of things here. First of all, I have never studied out of the King James bible in my life and never intend to. It is an obsolete language to me. I do not sup with people I do not beget and begat. If I do, I will be gone. That is an antiquated language to us. So these people that want to teach King James is the only bible, I have to say you have lost your mind. What about the Germans, the French, and the Italians. How are they ever going to be blessed by God because they sure do not have a King James version of the bible. It is nonsense. All of that King James only is nonsensical stuff being taught. It does nothing but divide the body. There are many fine translations of the bible. I never studied the King James bible. According to them, nobody should be listening to me. Here is a way I can know the bible because I have not studied King James. I used to memorize passages from the King James bible and it is a poetic language, but it is just antiquitated to me. I have difficulty understanding because of the structure whereas other translations are much easier. What has happened in this day and age, these King James only people, in essence, have said that translation supersedes the Greek. King James is not infallible. It is just a King James authorized version of the bible to be translated into English from, quite frankly, and most of it not even from Greek, but from Septuagint.
Bob: And so, those kinds of things irritate me because they are so nonsensical. I believe that I have a good understanding of the word of God because in the final analysis, God had to reveal the meaning of it to me regardless of what I was reading it from.
Bob: You take situations where people who are wanting to use that say, “see, in that translation, it did not say ‘God’.” Well, go back to the Greek. The Greek did not say “God”, but it certainly did not negate God or the Lord Jesus. They are coming up with arguments on these things that just do not make an ounce of sense. We can put that subject on the back burner.
Bob: For seeker-sensitive churches, people have to do what they think. I cannot handle that personally. What God said to me, I remember the time when the Lord was speaking in that quiet voice, and it was just making you through it. Bob, did I have a campus ministry, an executive ministry? What kind of ministry did I have? Lord, you had a ministry of the people. “Yes, that is what I want you to do. I want you to go out and present me and let whosoever will come.” That makes so much sense to me. The early church was made up of people who gathered daily for the apostle teaching, fellowship and prayer. We have ignored the apostle’s teaching fellowship and prayer. The church was there for fun and games, for bowling alleys and everything under the sun you can imagine. Where the Christian world is gathered into this one little spot and never have an opportunity to get among the lost.
Bob: When you are talking about this, let us get the music the children like. Why? I do not see why I need to sit down and develop music because a group of people likes it. Music should come out of your heart. In our assembly, I can just talk about what we are doing. I cannot keep my eyes on what others are doing. I told my music person, Richard, I want a balance between hymns and other music. We do not have any of the rock and roll stuff. To have music that is more modern but to have a balance. That is what we try to obtain, a balance. But the main reason people are coming to church is to hear teaching. It should be. I do not think you will build a big numerical church that way, Michael, to be real honest, because people are not really interested in knowing what the bible says.
Michael: That is what I was confused about. The church I am going to now is not King James only. I wanted to clear that up.
Bob: They should not even be mentioning it. King James only, or whatever bible you read, read it.
Michael: I think it is what the pastor reads. I think you can read what you want to. That is not a big issue. The church I left was a really big church, and I felt, what is more important, size or quality of message?
Bob: It is the quality of the message, brother, from the word of God, Michael. It has to be the quality of the message. I have been around for a long time. You have seminars on how to build churches and how to do this. They take the same methods, and they are good methods as far as getting people into your building. They are effective methods but there is no mention of Jesus. So you get a bunch of people to have a big building to house the lost people and carnal people. I do not want to do that. I want the building to be filled with people who know Jesus, who love Jesus, and want to learn more about Jesus. I do not want to build an entertainment center for people. I want to have a place for people who can sincerely grow in their knowledge of Christ Jesus. Which is what it says in scripture.
Michael: I think you are right on that. I think when your attention is on things that are going on, it is not that those things are bad, but they become a substitute instead of a supplement. I believe anything that God will bless a supplement He will curse as a substitute.
Bob: Does that help, brother?
Michael: Yes it does a lot.
Bob: You are definitely welcome, my friend. I wish you the best in your search. You are on the right track there. You are looking for quality of teaching. That is what ultimately will sustain you.
Michael: This is the first time I heard your show. This is good timing.
Bob: Well good, Michael. God bless you and keep listening, my friend.
Michael: I will.
Bob: Alright, my friend. Bye. Bye now.
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