Call-In Classic Christianity Radio – Bob George P621 (04-01-21)
Synopsis
Questions that come up quite frequently are questions in regard to tithing and various passages in the Old Testament. Questions like, “How does that passage apply to me today?” It doesn’t. The most prevalent question is in regard to tithing. “Am I robbing God when I do not tithe?” Absolutely not. If a person understood the New Covenant they are living under today, they would not need to ask such questions, for the answer would be very clear. These questions can easily be answered from the scriptures themselves, and anyone who has the Spirit of God living in Him, would then be able to discern the truth on these things.
First of all, to get a grasp of what the New Covenant is we live under today, the book of Hebrews is a book strongly encouraged that you read. There you will discover that the New Covenant replaced the Old Covenant. There is a new priest now, who is Christ Jesus, and there are no more sacrifices for sin, no more need to sacrifice bulls and goats anymore, and because of Jesus’ shed blood on a cross our sins will be remembered no more. He will not come to shed His blood again, for without the shedding of blood there is no forgiveness of sins, and He is not coming back to die on a cross again.
So with that understanding, then all the other questions concerning Old Testament passages are understood, whether it is about Job, or king David praying for God to not take the Holy Spirit from him, or whether we are obligated to tithe. He is not writing to us under an Old Covenant system. As a Gentile we were never under the law. And you are now set free from the law of sin and death to live under a new law of liberty in Christ, by faith in Christ Jesus under a covenant of grace. The book of Romans goes into great detail of how through the law is where we become conscious of what sin is so that we may seek a Savior in Christ Jesus. Whether we sin under the law or apart from the law, we are dead spiritually and in need of life. Because of our weak nature, dead in Adam, we were unable to keep the demands of the law, that if you fail at just one point, you are guilty of breaking all of the law, and the wages of sin is death. So God met the demands of the law for us, being that we could not do it. He fulfilled the law for us.
We also do not relate to what Job went through, but what we do know is that He trusted God in his trial and tribulation, and the essence of the story is that we live by trusting God, that what God says is true, that He will cause all things to work together for good. But the Old Testament is a testimony of man’s failures and is a different dispensation, requiring animal sacrifices to get sins covered until the next time man sins, and God’s faithfulness to His promise to redeem man through a promised Messiah to come, but the Messiah had not come yet.
Job could not trust Jesus with the finality of the cross. It had not occurred yet. He could not trust Him with resurrected life. It had not occurred yet. What does God want us to do on this side of the covenant? Keep trusting God except we have additional information revealed to us, and a dispensation where Jesus completed the work that God sent Him to do, which had not been finished in the time of Job. God spoke in various and sundry ways to people in the Old Covenant dispensation, in dreams and visions, but in these last days He has spoken to us through His Son, who now lives in us, leads us internally, and guides us into all truth.
So what about David’s prayer after the sin of adultery and then murder? Why did he pray that the Spirit would not leave him? Without even Jesus being born yet, the Spirit only came upon people for divine service, but could leave due to sin. We would not pray such a prayer today. Why not? Sin is out of the equation now that the sins of the entire world were placed on Christ, never to be seen again. Since Jesus finished the work of a once and for all, final sacrifice of Himself, the cause of our death, which is sin, is taken away, and therefore, since having risen from the dead, He is able to place the Holy Spirit in us forever, those who come to Him to receive that resurrected life.
So when a person is born again, he cannot die again. He has eternal life, the promised Holy Spirit living in him, never to leave him because of sin, because God will remember our sins no more. He deals with us on the basis as a child of God, a new creation with the mind of Christ living in you. The Holy Spirit lives in you to will and to act according to His good purpose. He works by renewing our mind with truth so we may realize all that He has freely given us, which is everything we need for life and godliness, having the righteousness of God placed in us.
Tithing can easily be understood as you just read through Malachi and realize he is talking to the descendants of Jacob? Are you a descendant of Jacob? No. So he is not talking to you. Tithing is tithing food stuff to support a Levitical priesthood, which is not even necessary today, with animal sacrifices no longer needed to cover sin. There is no reason to support Levitical priests to sacrifice bulls and goats any more, as that was just a temporary covering for sin until Christ should come.
As you read Hebrews and realize the New Covenant you are living under today, the concept of having to tithe is ludicrous. The apostle Paul never mentions it. But instead in two chapters in Corinthians he talks about New Testament giving, willingly, cheerfully, without compulsion, in accordance with what you do have and not in accordance with what you do not have, and as you are led to do by the Spirit of God living in you, full of joy and generously as your heart desires to do. We live under a covenant of grace in Christ Jesus.
Transcript
Don from Fresno, CA
Don: I have a question to do with punishment. We look at Job and how God interacted with him. Have you considered my servant Job? Job went through a tremendous amount of pain. God ordained this and God allowed this. How about us today? Does God just allow things to happen through us? Or is it what we do as to what James said that when lust is conceived, then we have all these problems that come to us? I am hearing taught that you are going through this hell because God is allowing it or God is putting it on you so that you can learn. If you did not go through this hell, you would not know how good God was.
Job 1:8
8 Then the Lord said to Satan, “Have you considered my servant Job? There is no one on earth like him; he is blameless and upright, a man who fears God and shuns evil.”
Job 2:3
3 Then the Lord said to Satan, “Have you considered my servant Job? There is no one on earth like him; he is blameless and upright, a man who fears God and shuns evil. And he still maintains his integrity, though you incited me against him to ruin him without any reason.”
James 1:14-15
14 but each person is tempted when they are dragged away by their own evil desire and enticed. 15 Then, after desire has conceived, it gives birth to sin; and sin, when it is full-grown, gives birth to death.
Bob: To a degree, that is dangerous teaching. It puts God in a position of being an ogre. But the issue is the majority of problems we have on this earth we brought upon ourselves in one form or another. That was not certainly the case with all things, such as people who have diseases that they had nothing to do with. Then we talk about God allowed it. The thing of it is, God is not sitting there saying “I am going to allow this”. God allowed man to have free will and I think it stops there. The opposite of that is to create man as a robot. I do not think any of us would like being robots. So He gave us a choice. He gave us the ability to choose. That is a part of our soul, to have a will and a choice, knowing full well that doing that was a gamble connected with it. The gamble is that man would not choose to live in accordance to the will of God, at the instructions of God, but with the will to live separate or independent from God. But that gamble was worth it because He was not going to create robots down here.
Bob: With that choice, to make man with a choice and a will, then God has to get out of the way because He is not going to give you a will but every time you make a bad decision He is going to intervene in that and correct it. That would mean we would have no real problems on this earth because God intervenes in everything. Every time I got a dumb thing I want to do He would come in and intervene and stop it. If He did this with everybody on the face of this earth, we would not have any problems. But He is not going to do that either. So He said, “I am going to give you choices. I am going to give you a choice as to whether you are going to follow the Lord or follow the desires of your own flesh. You are going to see the results of that type of thing.
Bob: I think so many times the words we use, such as “God allowed it”. In other words, He knew what was happening and He is not going to get involved in it. That is not the issue. The issue is that decision was made when man made a choice. I believe what it says in scripture.
Romans 8:28
28 And we know that in all things God works for the good of those who love him, who have been called according to his purpose.
Bob: He did not say He will make bad good. But He says, “if you allow me, I will cause it to work together for your good”. Every trial and tribulation I can think of I brought upon myself. The things I did and the choices I made made me so miserable that it prepared me for salvation. I would not have been ready for salvation if the things I thought would work didn’t. It was making me into someone I did not want to be. Did God cause that? No, I caused that. I was the one who made the choices. But God was always there saying, “Come to me”. There is where God is involved in the life of people, saying, “Come to me”. That never changes. His Spirit is always out there saying to man, “Come to me”.
Don: My other question. How does this equate to Job? God does say in the scripture, “Have you considered my servant Job?” Satan came to the conversation with the sons of men. “Where have you been?” “To and from”.
Bob: Don, again, I think that so many times we have never come to grips and grabbed a hold of the difference between the Old Covenant and the New Covenant. God is dealing with us on a brand new basis altogether. If there was no dynamic in the New Covenant, Jesus should have stayed at home for He is the initiator of the New Covenant, having fulfilled the Old. He is the one who ushered in the New Covenant and said this is the covenant of grace I want you to live in. He said to pastors, to be ministers of a New Covenant, not of an Old Covenant, or of the law that kills, but of the Spirit that gives life.
2 Corinthians 3:6
6 He has made us competent as ministers of a new covenant – not of the letter but of the Spirit; for the letter kills, but the Spirit gives life.
Bob: So we live in a totally different dispensation altogether. We are living today indwelt by the living God, no longer led by the law written on stone, but indwelt by the living Christ, who guides us into all truth. We do not live in the Old. We live in the New. We are called to live in the newness of life with our sins behind the back of God, never to see them again. There was no situation like that in the Old Covenant at all. The best they could do is get sins covered until the next time, called the atonement. We live as totally forgiven people. They are on their own. Here is the law so obey it. They could not do it. So the law had to be canceled and usher in the condition of grace we live under today.
Romans 8:2-4
2 because through Christ Jesus the law of the Spirit who gives life has set you free from the law of sin and death. 3 For what the law was powerless to do because it was weakened by the flesh, God did by sending his own Son in the likeness of sinful flesh to be a sin offering. And so he condemned sin in the flesh, 4 in order that the righteous requirement of the law might be fully met in us, who do not live according to the flesh but according to the Spirit.
Bob: So people drag over a lot of Old Testament stories and think that is part of our lives. No it isn’t. That is the Old Testament. That is how God was dealing with people under an Old Covenant but He is dealing with us on a totally different basis today, under a New Covenant ushered in by Christ Jesus.
Hebrews 10:8-10
8 First he said, “Sacrifices and offerings, burnt offerings and sin offerings you did not desire, nor were you pleased with them” – though they were offered in accordance with the law. 9 Then he said, “Here I am, I have come to do your will.” He sets aside the first to establish the second. 10 And by that will, we have been made holy through the sacrifice of the body of Jesus Christ once for all.
Bob: We really cannot look at what was said in those passages and say that is applicable to us today, any more than we can look at the promises He made to Israel and say that is applicable to us today. He was not talking to us. He was talking to Israel.
Bob: I wish the Christian world, Don, would get a hold of the difference between the two. What we have done is commingle law and grace. That is what the apostle Paul was dealing with in Galatians.
Galatians 3:1
1 You foolish Galatians! Who has bewitched you? Before your very eyes Jesus Christ was clearly portrayed as crucified. 2 I would like to learn just one thing from you: Did you receive the Spirit by the works of the law, or by believing what you heard? 3 Are you so foolish? After beginning by means of the Spirit, are you now trying to finish by means of the flesh?
Bob: “You foolish Galatians. You are commingling law and grace. You cannot do that. You are under a totally different way of living altogether. You are living indwelt by God. God restored in us what we had lost in Adam, that being the Spirit of God living in us. You are living in a brand new way of life altogether.
Colossians 1:27
27 To them God has chosen to make known among the Gentiles the glorious riches of this mystery, which is Christ in you, the hope of glory.
Bob: It is not that we cannot gain some insight from the Old Testament and learn how God dealt with His people back under an Old Covenant. The Old Covenant is a picture of man’s failure and God’s provision. But His ultimate provision came in Christ Jesus. We are on this side of the cross and I really feel that if we would just devote ourselves to the fact that this is the covenant we live under today and look at the Old Covenant as history, we would get along a lot better in our understanding of scripture.
Don: Okay. So you are saying that if I ever read the Old Testament, I could survive and live as a great Christian without living by the Old Covenant and living by the New Covenant.
Bob: Absolutely. For us Gentiles that is all we had. The Gentiles never had the Old Covenant. The law was never given to the Gentiles.
Don: Alright.
Bob: So if it was other than that, we could not be living today. Now, it is not that we cannot glean from history. You can always glean from history but as far as how you live your life here, there is no place in the Old Testament of living your life by being indwelt by Jesus. It is an entirely new way of life in which we live. I have just found, in my experience, and I studied the Old Testament, but I do not live by the Old Testament. I live in the newness of life that came with Jesus. That is why I say in times past God spoke to us in various and asundry ways through dreams and visions and then comes the but. But means a contrast. But in these last days, He has spoken to us through His Son, Jesus Christ. That is where we live.
Hebrews 1:1-2
1 In the past God spoke to our ancestors through the prophets at many times and in various ways, 2 but in these last days he has spoken to us by his Son
Don: Okay. So how do I convince the preacher that the Old Testament and Job is not where we say that God is placing us in this situation. I truly believe that if I go through some situations, I have to look back and see what I have done to cause this to come upon me.
Bob: And to learn from it. And if the Holy Spirit of God is alive, living in you, He will lead you to that truth.
Don: Right.
Bob: Absolutely. You do not have to sit around. We laugh about sitting around with Job. There is nothing in Job’s life that I can relate to. I do not know anybody’s life that I can equate with that. It is a great story. And certainly a great story of faithfulness. But in the final analysis, what is the overall objective of that story? Job was faithful to keep trusting God. What does God want us to do on this side of the covenant. Keep trusting God. Job could not trust Jesus with the finality of the cross. It had not occurred yet. He could not trust Him with resurrected life. It had not occurred yet.
Don: Okay.
Bob: We are on a terrific side of this whole thing. We have received the ultimate of God’s revelation and we have received the ultimate of His provision, His Son Christ Jesus.
Don: Punishment is coming at the end result for non-believers. Some will be beat with many stripes and some with few stripes. I am not worried about that as I am living here presently. For when judgment comes, I want to make sure that I am not saying God did this to you so that you can learn how to give Him praise because if you did not go through this trial you would not know how good God is.
Bob: That has to be totally according to the situation and if God leads you to say that you say it. If He does not lead you to say it, you do not say it. We are too anxious to speak and we are too un-anxious to sit back and listen to wait on God to tell us what to say. But the whole issue is I do not think it makes any difference. If I am going through trials and tribulations, it makes no difference who puts it on me. I am in the midst of a trial and a tribulation and I am going to trust God with it.
Don: Okay. But you would not say that?
Bob: Did God give me melanoma on my back? I had two surgeries on my back that if it spread it would kill me. Goodness no. Staying out in the sun gave it to me. Did God give me a heart attack? No. That is my body. My body had a failure to it. The issue is that God is in the midst of me and whether I live or die, I am going into the presence of God. That is the big thing to it.
Don: Okay.
Bob: Okay?
Don: Thank you very much.
Bob: Alright, Don. God bless you, my friend. Bye. Bye.
Rick from Augusta, GA
Rick: Can you give me your understanding of Hebrews 6:4-6?
Bob: Sure.
Hebrews 6:4-6
4 It is impossible for those who have once been enlightened, who have tasted the heavenly gift, who have shared in the Holy Spirit, 5 who have tasted the goodness of the word of God and the powers of the coming age 6 and who have fallen away, to be brought back to repentance. To their loss they are crucifying the Son of God all over again and subjecting him to public disgrace.
Bob: The same thing is in chapter 10. You are talking about this New Covenant, Rick, the New Covenant that God has ushered in. A covenant that many times people do not even realize they are under. It is a covenant of grace.
Hebrews 10:16-18
16 “This is the covenant I will make with them after that time, says the Lord. I will put my laws in their hearts, and I will write them on their minds.”[Jeremiah 31:33]17 Then he adds:
“Their sins and lawless acts I will remember no more.”[Jeremiah 31:34]
18 And where these have been forgiven, sacrifice for sin is no longer necessary.
Bob: To the Jew, the way they got their sins forgiven was the sacrificial system, wasn’t it? Going back to the day of atonement and getting their sins forgiven. That is why the priest’s work was never done.
Hebrews 10:11
11 Day after day every priest stands and performs his religious duties; again and again he offers the same sacrifices, which can never take away sins.
Bob: The reason he is standing is because his work was never finished. His religious duties could never take away sins. So to them, he would be saying that the sacrificial system is over. Shut it down because there is no more sacrifice for sins. If He was talking to us today, he would be talking to a Catholic, saying you might as well put those confessional booths away because it is over. There is no more forgiveness of sins. There is no more penance. There was never any to begin with. The issue is there is no more forgiveness of sins. You do not go anywhere to get forgiveness except to anyone except Christ Jesus. And once you have come to Jesus, you have forgiveness. To the Protestant, He would be saying why are you trying to keep short accounts with God to keep your sins forgiven, quoting 1 John 1:9, thinking that your confession to God is what is activating God’s forgiveness for you? There is no more forgiveness. It is over. It is done.
Bob: To us to get that through our hard heads is almost impossible it seems. Our heads are like bricks. When Jesus said it is finished then He meant it is finished. So He is saying to these people, it is impossible for those who have been enlightened. You have tasted. In other words, you have been exposed to all these things. You have tasted. You have been enlightened. You have shared the Holy Spirit. You tasted the goodness of the word of God. So if you fall away, in other words, if you go back to your sacrificial system you cannot be brought back to repentance because you never repented to begin with or you would not have gone back there because to your loss you are crucifying the Son of God all over again, subjecting Him to public disgrace.
Bob: So Rick, He is saying the reason you cannot be brought back to repentance is because you have never repented. I have told people, “Have you ever noticed how difficult it is to go back to where you have never been?” These people have tasted, had shared, but have never given their hearts to it. So out of one side of the mouth, saying Jesus took away all my sins, and the other side of the mouth you are going back to your sacrificial system. So He is saying by your refusing to believe that Jesus completed His work at the cross, and saying there is more forgiveness to be executed, which is what the sacrificial system would do, an ongoing, never ending forgiveness, He said to your loss you are crucifying the Son of God all over again and subjecting Him to public disgrace.
Hebrews 9:22
22 In fact, the law requires that nearly everything be cleansed with blood, and without the shedding of blood there is no forgiveness.
Bob: What does that mean there? If Jesus did not take away sins at the cross and you want more forgiveness, and without the shedding of blood there is no forgiveness, then you will have to drag Him back and crucify Him all over again, and expose Him to the public disgrace He had to go through in order to take away your sins to begin with. The further explanation of that is given in Hebrews 10:26.
Hebrews 10:26
26 If we deliberately keep on sinning after we have received the knowledge of the truth, no sacrifice for sins is left, 27 but only a fearful expectation of judgment and of raging fire that will consume the enemies of God.
The knowledge of truth was given in the scriptures discussed earlier.
Hebrews 10:27-28
“Their sins and lawless acts I will remember no more.”[Jeremiah 31:34]18 And where these have been forgiven, sacrifice for sin is no longer necessary.
Bob: You keep going back to your sacrificial system, what you are doing is deliberately sinning after you received the knowledge of truth. You go back and continue to develop systems to keep forgiven. There is no more forgiveness. There is no more sacrifice. You are sinning against the knowledge of truth. It says there, that is a fearful thing, and if you deliberately continue doing that, then you have nothing to look forward to except a fearful expectation of judgment and of raging fire that will consume the enemies of God.
Hebrews 10:28-30
28 Anyone who rejected the law of Moses died without mercy on the testimony of two or three witnesses. 29 How much more severely do you think someone deserves [does not say He will] to be punished who has trampled the Son of God underfoot, who has treated as an unholy thing the blood of the covenant that sanctified them, and who has insulted the Spirit of grace? 30 For we know him who said, “It is mine to avenge; I will repay,”[Deuteronomy 32:35] and again, “The Lord will judge his people.”[Deuteronomy 32:36; Psalm 135:14] 31 It is a dreadful thing to fall into the hands of the living God.
Bob: That is what any of us are doing or have done who are refusing to believe what Jesus said when He cried out on the cross when He said, “It is finished” and refusing to believe what the writer of Hebrews is saying that their sins and lawless acts I will remember no more and where these are forgiven there is no more sacrifice for sins, and continue to go back and develop your sacrificial systems, your confession booths, your short accounts with God, your 1 John 1:9 and all those things instead of resting in the fact that it is finished.
John 19:30
30 When he had received the drink, Jesus said, “It is finished.” With that, he bowed his head and gave up his spirit.
Bob: It is over. It is done. That is what faith is. Faith says, “Thank you”. So what He is saying there is that if you are going to go back it means you do not believe it. If you said to me, “Bob, I have forgiven you of all your sins”. And I say, “Thank you, Rick. That is really great”. Then I go back to you, Rick, and I say, “Will you please forgive me of my sin, Bob?” “I have already told you that all your sins are forgiven.” “Yes, I know but” and I keep saying “But. But. But”, then it means that I do not believe you when you tell me you have forgiven me of all my sins. It is that clear. I did not believe it.
Bob: This whole area of salvation is in believing by faith. Have you completely put your faith in the finished work of Christ? I am afraid that many people have not put their faith in the completed work of Christ. People are trying to complete it for Him. When He said “it is completed” and they say “No. I am going to complete it for you.” If that continues, and God knows our hearts. I do not, but God does. But if we continue in that, then it could be a sign that you never changed your mind or repented to begin with. That is what those two areas are talking about.
Bob: Rick, I hope that helps. Those two passages have caused a lot of difficulty. Those who want to beat you to death to convince you that you can lose your salvation, pull these verses out and those verses are talking to them. Satan will use anything he can to keep people away from the finality of the cross.
Rick: Bob, God bless you.
Bob: Same to you, Rick. Talk to you later.
Jerry from Whittaker, CA
Bob: This is a fantastic day for me. I have a question. I was at a men’s bible study in church and I invited a friend. The minister says if we come across someone in our life who needs to hear the word and we do not share the word and that person dies and goes to hell, then that person’s blood is on our hands. I was shocked. I did not expect my friend to hear this. I was shocked to hear this. I was burdened with something like that. In a question also about tithing. He told us if we were not tithing, we would be ripping God off. I thought it was supposed to be a New Testament not an Old Testament walk. I will get off the phone and let you preach on that.
Bob: You do not need to do that but you can if you wish.
Bob: My advice to you is to find a new church or a new study. This guy who is teaching this! First of all, can you imagine this, if you are lost, only your blood is on your hands. When you are saved, then everybody’s blood is on your hands. There was a man named Gage who wrote an evangelistic book with hands reaching down, with blood dripping all over. What kind of a real encouraging thing for people to be doing and saying? What kind of a God do you think you have that He needs you and me, that if we fail in witnessing Christ to somebody, then God just sends someone else to them. God is not impotent in His ability to get the gospel to people. These kinds of people, these are the people who are out telling you if you do not do this, God is going to zap you. If you do not tithe to God you are going to go to hell. And if you do not do this, the blood of Jesus is on your hands. They are do-do teachers. They really are do-do Christians. You need to get away from that teaching, for it will drive you crazy, if you ever adhere to any of that.
Jerry: Can you talk about tithing?
Bob: There is nothing really to talk about on tithing. It is not in the New Testament. So if anyone wants to teach it they have to go back to the Old Testament and teach it. While they are there, why not just bring a bull and a goat and slay it on the altar. How are you going to play spiritual hopscotch with scripture? If tithing is in effect so is not eating pork. All of the other dietary laws are still in effect if that is the case. If you violate one, you violate all of them. If you are going to hold onto circumcision, then you are obligated to obey the entire law. If you are going to go by the law of tithing, then you are obligated to obey all of it. If that is the kind of life a person wants to live, let him have at it. It is not New Testament, brother.
Jerry: Thank you so much, brother. I have been listening to you on radio for fifteen years. I never wanted to miss what you are saying. God bless you. Thank you so much. I am glad God has blessed you with this radio ministry. God bless you and your family with peace, joy and long life.
Bob: Thank you so much, Jerry. The same to you, my brother. Bye. Bye.
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