Call-In Classic Christianity Radio – Bob George P482 (10-16-19)
Synopsis
What is so hard to take is when someone you love dies. Also in the world today, events are unfolding in Israel and there seems to be an increasing frequency of floods and earthquakes. The callers today asked these kinds of questions: What about my loved ones that have died before me? Will I ever see them again? If they are born again, will they get their new glorified bodies at the rapture or immediately when they die? Are we in the end times? How should I be prepared for death or end time events?
Callers also asked questions for clarity on understanding a passage of scripture. One caller asked, “Who wrote the book of Hebrews?” Another caller asked, in regards to John 14:1, “who do we pray to, Jesus or God?” In regards to Matthew 12:43-46, another caller was wondering about casting out demons today, like people that say they do exorcisms?
Transcript
Eulin from Vancouver, British Columbia
Eulin: In regards to Hebrews, when the canon was closed and Hebrews was included, and is likely Paul is the author, is it not ascribed widely that Paul is the author, or is it still left up in the air as far as when the canon was closed?
Bob: It is not up in the air when the canon was closed. But it is up in the air as to who wrote the book of Hebrews. But it is obviously decided that this is the inherent word of God. Regardless, I do not think anyone ever sat down and said this is definitely who wrote it. There is a lot of speculation on that. I do not think it is Paul who wrote it for the reason that he gives in the the fact that the second generation it talks about in scripture, which included himself in. But on the other hand, we do not know for sure. But one thing we do know, it is probably the most important book in the New Testament.
Eulin: Absolutely. My translation is inscribing Hebrews to Paul but when I heard you say that Paul wasn’t the writer is why I was curious to your thoughts along that line. When you read it, it is structured as if his fingerprints all over it, with the structure and clarity and how stated so practically. I was thinking it was Paul who wrote this.
Bob: Normally in Paul’s writings, you normally saw the doctrinal basis established first and then the application. In Hebrews, there is not this order of doctrine established. It just kind of hits you right in the head right away. In the past he spoke to our forefathers, then he spoke to us with Jesus. Then it just goes right into the superiority of Christ Jesus. So it was a little different format than Paul’s writings. Then again, whether it was Paul or Barnabas or someone else. There are a lot of people who have speculated who could have been the writer, but one thing they are all in agreement is that the book of Hebrews is God breathed.
Eulin: Same thing with 1 John, where we have that misquoting of 1 John 1:8-9. When someone is writing a letter to Ephesus, when the people were translating word of God in Greek was there not some kind of, what was the thought behind it. Were they not too concerned about the nuances because that would have absolutely helped a lot of Christians.
Bob: In Greek there is no confusion to it at all. In 1 John 1:9 it is aorist tense, which is past event that took place. It is only when we translated it we messed it up. In the original Greek it was clear as a bell. In 95 A.D., approximately when 1 John was written, we know that the cross occurred around 33 A.D., so it is not the case of wondering when it occurred. We know exactly when it occurred. Therefore to translate that in any other way except in the aorist tense, which that he has cleansed and has forgiven of all our sins, that is the only way literally you could translate it.
Eulin: In a lot of Christian circles claiming it is written to Christians. If the nuance was as such that was written to Christian pastor and written to a mixed congregation of believers and non-believers, giving us some kind of background, before you got into the letter. We have so many Christians today still using 1 John 1:9 telling us written to Christians and this is why we have to keep asking for forgiveness.
Bob: Do you know what I call that? Sinning against the knowledge of truth.
Eulin: There is a lot of that going on as you know.
Bob: You cannot call it anything other than exactly what it is, people who keep on sinning after they received the knowledge of the truth. They want to keep adding to what Jesus did.
Eulin: I appreciate you guys very much. I hope one day you get to Vancouver and help us up here, for we need it. Thank you for your ministry and the resources you have available. I got a book for my wife for Christmas. I got “Battle Control”, “Truth to Stand On” and “Victory over Depression”. I am very interested in getting a deeper understanding of the word of God, for counsel, not just for salvation, but for many areas in life. We appreciate you guys very much.
Bob: You are sure welcome, brother. We appreciate you too. You call again, pal.
Wayne
Wayne: How is everybody?
Bob: Okay. Thank you.
Wayne: I am calling for you to clarify something for me. We read in Genesis 39:33 about Jacob giving up ghost and being gathered to his people. Does that mean we are going to recognize our loved ones when we get to heaven or not?
Bob: Yes, Wayne. When we leave this earth, as born again believers, we are absent from the body and immediately present with the Lord. That is the scripture.
2 Corinthians 5:8 (KJV)
8 We are confident, I say, and willing rather to be absent from the body, and to be present with the Lord.
Philippians 1:21 (KJV)
For to me to live is Christ, and to die is gain.
Bob: We go immediately to the presence of God. I believe, contrary to what many, many people teach, that you have to wait for the rapture to get your glorified body. Right now I am complete in Christ, and I have a body, but when I die I wander around, floating around without one. So I am incomplete after I die but I am complete now? That does not make any sense to me. I think we get our glorified bodies immediately. I think those glorified bodies are, even though there is nothing in those physical bodies that we have now goes to heaven.
1 Corinthians 15:50 (KJV) 50 Now this I say, brethren, that flesh and blood cannot inherit the kingdom of God
Bob: There is not anything about our loved ones, in flesh and blood we can see that is going to be in heaven. But we get a glorified body. We do not know what that means. We do not have a clue as to what it looks like.
Wayne: The disciples recognized Jesus when he appeared.
John 20:19-20 (NIV)
19 On the evening of that first day of the week, when the disciples were together, with the doors locked for fear of the Jewish leaders, Jesus came and stood among them and said, “Peace be with you!” 20 After he said this, he showed them his hands and side. The disciples were overjoyed when they saw the Lord.
John 21:1,4 (NIV)
1 Afterward Jesus appeared again to his disciples, by the Sea of Galilee. 14 This was now the third time Jesus appeared to his disciples after he was raised from the dead.
Bob: Sure. Absolutely. So we will recognize each other, know each other, and love each other, but the main thing is we will be in the presence of Jesus. With our loved ones, my family that are all gone to be with the Lord, except my brothers and my immediate family, and they are all in Christ Jesus, and they are having a ball and I am down here having to fight this world. So they are in a lot better place than we are. One day, when I leave this body of mine, I will be in the presence of my Lord Jesus Christ. So we will recognize one another, see one another and fellowship with one another.
Wayne: Is that your personal belief, or is that backed up with
scripture?
Bob: It is backed up with the scripture.
Wayne: They did recognize Jesus.
Bob: Look at the transfiguration. They all had bodies. They did not have to wait for the rapture. When absent from the body, we are present with the Lord and we are complete. We are not only complete here but we are also complete there. I do not think there is anything left to do when we go to be with Him there.
Matthew 17:1 (NIV)
1 After six days Jesus took with him Peter, James and John the brother of James, and led them up a high mountain by themselves. 2 There he was transfigured before them. His face shone like the sun, and his clothes became as white as the light. 3 Just then there appeared before them Moses and Elijah, talking with Jesus.
Wayne: So we will recognize our loved ones?
Bob: Absolutely. We sure will.
Wayne: I really appreciate that. I heard someone mention that was not going to happen so I wanted to get a couple of other Christians opinions on that. I heard you the other day and the Spirit moved me to call you. I feel a lot better.
Bob: That is something you can count on for sure.
Wayne: Thank you.
Bob: Your welcome, my friend.
Eddie from Arlington,TX
Eddie: My question had to do with John 14:1 where Jesus said to not be worried and upset, to believe in God and believe also in me. I have your book “Growing in Grace” and you mentioned three things; dependency, objectivity and availability. I know the object of the Christian faith is Christ. Sometimes when I try to focus on Christ, sometimes I think I focus on God also. I had experiences where I know they were from God and some that were from Christ yet scripture says they are the same. I was wondering if you could help me with that?
John 14:1 (NIV)
1 “Do not let your hearts be troubled. You believe in God; believe also in me.”
Bob: Eddie, I do not know how anybody can say I had an experience with God and not with Christ. Again, that is an impossibility. That is like saying I had an experience with a vine and a branch, or a vine and saying, I did not have it with the branch, for it is all one. It is all the same unit. “You trust in God the Father, you trust also in me”. Jesus also said, “I and the Father are one” (John 10:30). and “If you have seen me, you have seen the Father” (John 14:9).
John 10:30 (NV)
I and the Father are one.
John 14:9 (NIV)
Jesus answered: “Don’t you know me, Philip, even after I have been among you such a long time? Anyone who has seen me has seen the Father. How can you say, ‘Show us the Father’?”
John 4:23 (NIV)
23 Yet a time is coming and has now come when the true worshipers will worship the Father in the Spirit and in truth, for they are the kind of worshipers the Father seeks.
Bob: Our problem with that Eddie is we try to put flesh and blood on God. God is Spirit and we worship in Spirit and in truth (John 4:23). We try to put flesh and blood to have three entities there. In the spiritual realm, where God is, He exists in the person who he revealed to us, in the person of God the Father, God the Son and God the Holy Spirit. Do not put flesh and blood on it.
Bob: Recognize it is spiritual. We cannot comprehend that because we cannot comprehend Spirit but we can apprehend that. Our object of our faith, which you said very well, is Christ Jesus. He is the one who came to this earth so we can know the Father. I think that is important for us to understand. Everything God wanted us to know about Himself has been revealed in Christ Jesus. There is nothing else to seek when we have Christ Jesus. We have it all. Don’t seek the Father as people were doing. Don’t seek the Holy Spirit. You seek Jesus. He is the object of our faith. You are right on that, brother.
Eddie: Thank you, Bob. That simplified it a great deal.
Bob: God bless you my friend.
Steve from Corpus Christi, TX
Steve: How are you doing?
Bob: Doing very good. Thank you.
Steve: I listen to you all the time. I want to commend you. A lot of times people call, and they comment, and it is not always sound very nice. I just want to tell you, you do answer the questions, and to me, are very biblical appropriate. You are doing a real good job in south Texas and that is all I wanted to say today.
Bob: Thank you, Steve. We appreciate the encouragement. You keep listening.
Steve: Next time you come give us a holler.
Bob: We will brother. That is for sure, brother. You keep passing this on and getting more people to listen, Steve, for it is a message that people need to hear.
Steve: Absolutely. I agree with you. We do appreciate your message. We will see you later.
Bob: God bless my friend.
Fabian from Brownsville, TX
Fabian: On Matthew 12:43-46, can you tell me about that unclean spirit and where seven more wicked spirits enter? What is that?
Matthew 12:33-46 (NIV)
43 “When an impure spirit comes out of a person, it goes through arid places seeking rest and does not find it. 44 Then it says, ‘I will return to the house I left.’ When it arrives, it finds the house unoccupied, swept clean and put in order. 45 Then it goes and takes with it seven other spirits more wicked than itself, and they go in and live there. And the final condition of that person is worse than the first. That is how it will be with this wicked generation.”
Bob: I do not have it right in front of me but what I believe what that scripture there is talking about is the fact that demons go out from a person. Look, you see a lot of people getting into exorcism. What good would it do to do an exorcism and get demons out of a person if you do not get Jesus in the person. That is what it is saying here, that seven more will come back in.
Bob: The way you do a true exorcism is getting the right man in and the wrong man goes out. There is only one true curing of unclean spirits and that is the person putting Christ Jesus in their heart. That is their hope of glory. The demons and Jesus are not going to live in the same house. So it does not do any good to do these exorcisms you see people doing unless you put Jesus in your heart. If you put Jesus in your heart, the demons will go out anyways.
Fabian: So not talking about going to church where priest cleanses you?
Bob: No. You have already been cleansed of all your unrighteousness. That was placed at the cross for everybody.
2 Corinthians 5:18-20 (NIV)
18 All this is from God, who reconciled us to himself through Christ and gave us the ministry of reconciliation: 19 that God was reconciling the world to himself in Christ, not counting people’s sins against them.
Bob: There is no one whose sins have not been cleansed of all unrighteousness. But that is not salvation. As it says in Romans 5:8-10, while we were yet enemies, we were reconciled to him through the death of his Son, how much more, having been reconciled, that being an accomplished fact for the whole world, shall we be saved by his life.
Romans 5:8-10 (NIV)
8 But God demonstrates his own love for us in this: While we were still sinners, Christ died for us. 9 Since we have now been justified by his blood, how much more shall we be saved from God’s wrath through him! 10 For if, while we were God’s enemies, we were reconciled to him through the death of his Son, how much more, having been reconciled, shall we be saved through his life!
Bob: You are not saved by the death of Christ. You are saved by the life of Christ. You have been saved from the consequences of sin, which is death, by the gift of God, which is life. Forgiveness does not bring life to the dead. Life brings life from the dead.
Fabian: This does not have anything to do with a saved person who struggles with sin?
Bob: There is no way for a saved person to be demon possessed. You can be influenced. Any time you turn on the television you are influenced by demonic influences.
Fabian: So is this passage written to a saved person to be careful. Even though you are saved, you could get into drugs? You are saved, but you keep doing this or doing that. Is that what he means?
Bob: No, demon possession is demon possession. If you are possessed by a demon, the only way to get rid of those demons is through being born again. You cannot cast demons out without replacing with something. If you do not replace with Christ, which would be born again, then you are going to have a whole batch more coming in. The way in which you cure demon possession is, again, getting the right man in and the wrong man will go out.
Fabian: So this verse is on the demon stuff?
Bob: Yes. I have been in the ministry for 40 years. I have never encountered what you would call a person is being demon possessed. I might encounter a hint of someone who might be called demon possessed. But I do not go looking for them. There a lot of people dealing with that and they are like being demon possessed themselves. How many of you have been within 10 feet of a real live lion? Someone might say, “I have”. I say, “How come you are still alive?” Well, the lion is in a cage so that is why you are still here. How many of you would be here if you got in the cage with a lion? So that is what you have is people getting together in a group, talking about how they are being mauled by a lion. Why? They got in the cage.
Bob: But if I ever saw someone demon possessed, I would merely give the salvation message to them.
Mike from Atlanta, GA
Mike: Thanks for taking my phone call.
Bob: Your welcome.
Mike: My question is this. At the outset, I know that no one knows the exact hour of the return of Christ. You guys, in your heart of hearts, do you think we are in the last days? Are we getting close to the final?
Bob: Everything that takes place in history gets us closer. People thought during World War II, we were there. What makes you basically convinced that we are in the end times is because of Israel. All prophecies, and all end time prophecies, center around the nation of Israel. Until 1948, there was no nation of Israel. So when they became a nation, people started lifting up their eyes for the first time to take prophecy really seriously in regard to the fact we are heading toward the end times. That to me is the opening scene of end times coming to an end.
Matthew 24:3-14 (NIV)
3 As Jesus was sitting on the Mount of Olives, the disciples came to him privately. “Tell us,” they said, “when will this happen, and what will be the sign of your coming and of the end of the age?” 4 Jesus answered: “Watch out that no one deceives you. 5 For many will come in my name, claiming, ‘I am the Messiah,’ and will deceive many. 6 You will hear of
wars and rumors of wars, but see to it that you are not alarmed. Such things must happen, but the end is still to come. 7 Nation will rise against nation, and kingdom against kingdom. There will be famines and earthquakes in various places. 8 All these are the beginning of birth pains.9 “Then you will be handed over to be persecuted and put to death, and you will be hated by all nations because of me. 10 At that time many will turn away from the faith and will betray and hate each other, 11 and many false prophets will appear and deceive many people. 12 Because of the increase of wickedness, the love of most will grow cold, 13 but the one who stands firm to the end will be saved. 14 And this gospel of the kingdom will be preached in the whole world as a testimony to all nations, and then the end will come.
Bob: Then you start seeing all the different things they talk about. There has always been wars and rumors of wars, but not like in the proportion they are today. There have always been earthquakes, and those kinds of things, but never in proportion to how they are today. So when you see the nations surrounding Israel, and when you realize Armageddon is when all the nations surrounding Israel, but especially coming from the North, the southern end of Russia, which is totally preoccupied by Muslims. This is going to be a war between Muslims, Jews and the Christians. It is not Spain or anybody else. It is the Muslim world. That is who the enemy is. It is headed toward that. The things you see going on in Israel today, it is headed toward that. Everyone is crying out “peace, peace” but there will never be peace in Israel until Christ Jesus comes.
1 Thessalonians 5:3 (NIV)
3 While people are saying, “Peace and safety,” destruction will come on them suddenly, as labor pains on a pregnant woman, and they will not escape.
Bob: But there will be one who comes on the scene. He will be one smooth guy. He is going to make Clinton look like Willie Nelson. He is really going to be smooth. He is going to coerce people into getting people to think he is the answer to peace. People will be deceived again by him and so will the other nations. But he is going to turn. Those are interesting days.
Revelation 13:5-17 (NIV)
15 The second beast was given power to give breath to the image of the first beast, so that the image could speak and cause all who refused to worship the image to be killed. 16 It also forced all people, great and small, rich and poor, free and slave, to receive a mark on their right hands or on their foreheads, 17 so that they could not buy or sell unless they had the mark, which is the name of the beast or the number of its name.
Bob: Right now, I do not remember the name of the company, but right now they are making these chips that you can put under the skin, as protection. We have credit cards. We are headed toward a cashless society anyway. This is all part of prophecy, this cashless society. Now, you can be putting chips in there that you cannot steal. You cannot steal someone’s identity but you also cannot buy or sell. There is a coming day that you cannot buy or sell without that mark. They have done research on that. If this research is true, determining a place to plant those chips, that for some reason does not interfere with anything else in the body, is on the right hand or forehead. That totally falls into prophecy that is the sign of the beast, on the right hand or the forehead. There is a lot of very interesting prophecies that are there and they seem to be intensifying. I have never been one who has ever been excited about end times since I came to Christ in 1969. Today, I believe with all my heart that we are winding down. I think it is going to be soon.
Mike: I think probably something will not be right abut asking this question, but if you were a betting man, what would you say? I do not think it can be tomorrow because no one is on the scene, solving problems. It is something to think about when raising a family. What are we all in for?
Bob: Again Mike, I have to say, “How long are you going to live?” The chances are, at my age, I will go see the Lord prior to his coming back. I am just saying that, either way, I am prepared, but the issue is that I think that these signs are certainly there and are intensifying. I think we woke up the Muslim world. That is where the battle is going to be. It is the Muslim world, that is Satanically induced, committed to converting the entire world to Muslim, whatever it takes. How did they get started? Believe it or die. That is how they got started.
Mike: What doesn’t make sense to me in that scenario. Let’s say the Muslim religion is not very appealing to much of us in the West, with strict laws.
Bob: Look at all the past religions started in America right now.
Mike: I cannot imagine it replacing the liberal western lifestyle throughout Europe or America.
Bob: I cannot either but Satan has some strange ways of deceiving people. Again, America is not the focal point anywhere in the bible. Israel is the focal point.
Mike: One final question. Have you ever read where it talks about Babylon? Sometimes I thought, without any scriptural knowledge, but casual reading that maybe the United States is Babylon. Now that we are occupying Iraq, that maybe it is us.
Bob: No, Babylon is Babylon. We are not even mentioned. I know it is hard in our pride. We are not mentioned by God in the last times. Which means I think our influence will not be very great. There are a lot of events that have to take place before the end times, but we are in those birth pains phase without question.
